Season 2 - EP #8 - Geelong after hours, MRO again and player welfare

Season 2 - EP #8 - Geelong after hours, MRO again and player welfare

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Transcript

S2E8

[00:00:00] Wayne: I'm Wayne Carey, and this is The Truth Hurts. Well, here we are again for The Truth Hurts, episode 8, Tony. It's 

[00:00:10] Tony: been a, uh, it's been a good 8 episodes, Bueno. 

[00:00:13] Wayne: Oh, I'm not Did you bring an umbrella today? It's only 25 degrees in the sun out. 

[00:00:18] Tony: Well, you wouldn't believe this. You know, after we had lunch at Mah Jong in St Kilda last week, I left the umbrella there.

[00:00:25] Tony: So you haven't had one since? No, well I've been in Sydney all week where the sun has been out. I'll tell you what, I'm getting a lot of 

[00:00:31] Wayne: feedback on, uh, on your umbrella. 

[00:00:33] Tony: Oh yeah? 

[00:00:34] Wayne: From? Everyone rinkered you're a real winker. 

[00:00:36] Tony: Oh well I'll take that as a compliment. 

[00:00:38] Wayne: Walking around, so you haven't got one today?

[00:00:40] Wayne: No I didn't bring 

[00:00:41] Tony: one today, I think it's the first of the eight episodes where I actually don't need an umbrella, it's a beautiful 22 

[00:00:47] Wayne: outside in Melbourne. And apparently we're going to get another week of this in Melbourne. They reckon it's going to be a nice, uh, we're not weather people here, by the way.

[00:00:52] Wayne: Well, I am. I do like talking about it, given that you come in here with an umbrella every week. 

[00:00:57] Tony: Well, I've been in Sydney for the best part of, uh, [00:01:00] last week. 

[00:01:00] Wayne: What were you doing up there? 

[00:01:01] Tony: Well, I had, uh, fantastic hospitality from, uh, Ben Stewart, Ian's son. He looked after me for the first three days. It was sensational up there, beautiful penthouse overlooking the Harbour Bridge.

[00:01:13] Tony: It's very hospitable. So you were 

[00:01:14] Wayne: basically squatting with mates 

[00:01:15] Tony: up 

[00:01:16] Wayne: in Sydney 

[00:01:16] Tony: again. No, I wasn't squatting. No, I had one night at Ben's where we watched Melbourne and Brisbane and then I went to the hotel for the remaining two days. 

[00:01:23] Wayne: You're a professional squatter, you are. 

[00:01:25] Tony: Yep, and you still working out for the Bonds factory?

[00:01:29] Wayne: I tell you what, I tell you what I do want to say. So big weekend of footy. We know that. A lot of, uh, well, a lot of ordinary games, some good games, by the way, I'm still in my band. I'm still, I've not watched footy. I've seen snippets of things, I've watched snippets of things and we'll get into that. The MRO and, uh, boy, yeah, 

[00:01:46] Tony: the MRO, 

[00:01:47] Wayne: there's a lot of, what about 

[00:01:48] Tony: the score review system?

[00:01:49] Wayne: Yeah, that's, that's in all sorts of trouble as well, but I tell you what I did yesterday. So there's, Obviously games of footy going on one down at Geelong, which wasn't a great one. But I went to watch Marvel [00:02:00] live. That doesn't mean Marvel stadium. Yeah. I went to watch the Marvel show. So 

[00:02:04] Tony: is this a comic thing?

[00:02:06] Wayne: Well, obviously. Oh, Marvel. What do you think? Do you think the Marvel characters are real life? Tony is. Wayne, just for those who aren't familiar with it, just to explain. Okay, well you've got Iron Man and Spider Man and the Hulk and all of these guys, right? That, so anyway. Did Carter take you or did you take Carter?

[00:02:22] Wayne: I took Carter. He didn't take you? And his little mate. He's a little ginger haired mate, right? So Jess and I took the two little kids. And his little ginger mate, who I hadn't taken on an excursion before, he, he dropped his, his, his Spider Man mug about eight times. Yeah. He straw about twelve times, fell off the seat six times.

[00:02:43] Wayne: He, he was a bit, so you get to know these little, uh, little fellas. Idiosyncrasies. And then you had Jess, who's eyeing off, who's eyeing off, um, what's his name, uh, Captain America. 

[00:02:55] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:02:55] Wayne: So, I've, I, I was, it's the first show. What were you doing? Well, I was [00:03:00] just trying to make out I was interested in the show.

[00:03:02] Wayne: Well, this is for your son and his mate. You ought to be enthusiastic. It was, you know what, it was, it was a lot of fun. I'll tell you what, packed. 

[00:03:10] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:03:10] Wayne: Kids going everywhere. Wait, is this at 

[00:03:12] Tony: Docklands? 

[00:03:13] Wayne: It was at the Tennis Centre. 

[00:03:14] Tony: Okay. 

[00:03:14] Wayne: Rod Laver Arena. Which, so, a bit of an experience doing that for, you know, first time.

[00:03:19] Wayne: Normally on a, uh, on a nice Sunday afternoon, I'd be, you know, maybe at a local, uh, Watering hole. Watering hole somewhere or at the footy. I don't know. Somewhere. Yeah. The Emerald. 

[00:03:32] Tony: Yeah. The Maros. Nandy Lewis. Where else? Where 

[00:03:35] Wayne: else? All of the local, uh, the Rising Sun. 

[00:03:38] Tony: Where you've paid half of the 

[00:03:39] Wayne: mortgages.

[00:03:40] Wayne: Can we name, can we name another hotel? Maybe. Botanical. Maybe. Yeah, head to the Bot. What's that? College Lawn. The Gilson. College. The Gilson. Yeah, anyway. All of, all of those. You're not working for the age good food god, are you? Sometimes. Without being facetious, I, 

[00:03:56] Tony: or self deprivation, I could 

[00:03:58] Wayne: have, I could have visited just about [00:04:00] all of those on one given Sunday.

[00:04:02] Tony: And Saturday and Friday and Thursday. 

[00:04:04] Wayne: Now, I do want to talk about Geelong. 

[00:04:07] Tony: Yes. 

[00:04:07] Wayne: Because I've been going, Geelong the footy club? That's where, that's where Jess and her family are from. So we've been going down to Torquay a little bit, driving up and back for quite some, uh, well, number of weeks now, especially while the weather's been good.

[00:04:20] Wayne: And, going up a bit. Geelong's actually, I know Torcay, we know Torcay. It's right there, it's a beautiful little part of the town. And I'm at Dels Beach. It's growing very quickly, and I've got some good mates that are down there as well, so it's worthwhile going down there all the time. But Geelong gets a bad rap.

[00:04:37] Wayne: I like their rap. I think it's, it's a thriving little place. Thriving 

[00:04:42] Tony: metropolis, you think? 

[00:04:43] Wayne: Obviously their footy team has been very good for a long period of time. Albeit they were playing some pretty ordinary opponents 

[00:04:49] Tony: yesterday. What, they're 5 think they've been average? 

[00:04:53] Wayne: Mate, look who they've played.

[00:04:55] Wayne: They've played the Bulldogs, who not exactly setting the world on fire. They played North Melbourne [00:05:00] yesterday, 10 goals. They played the Saints in the first game down there as well. So the Saints, and I don't think the Saints had their full compliment, um, that particular day. And I think they only, well, they only just won that and they played Hawthorne and Adelaide have been in ordinary form.

[00:05:14] Wayne: So they're five and zero, but they've played no one. And three of those have been at home. So I'm not. Convinced on Geelong just yet. They're a great team. They're well coached I love everything about the way them as a footy club No doubt about that, but I want to talk and they had some big outs. They well 

[00:05:32] Tony: Well Dangerfield and Hawkins are two pretty big ones.

[00:05:35] Wayne: Yeah, but you're playing the kangaroos. They could have rested another four or five And I'm not, that's, that's not being rude. Where are you going with this, why no? It's not being rude. I'll tell you where I'm going with it. They've had a strip joint down there. 

[00:05:47] Tony: Oh, 

[00:05:48] Wayne: are we, are we going down this path, are we?

[00:05:50] Wayne: Well, because they, strip joints are a part of a lot of towns, Tony. People, they, they, they employ people. Yes. So they are a big, [00:06:00] this particular strip joint used to be called Alley Cats. I'm looking around, uh, our main man here from Torched, Ben, and he's a Geelong boy. And I reckon he's, uh, Ben, are you familiar with alley cats?

[00:06:12] Wayne: How many, uh, times have you been in alley cats, Ben? He looks like an alley cat, uh, alley cats sort of dweller. 

[00:06:18] Tony: Well, what about baby cats? Is that one of yours? 

[00:06:21] Wayne: Baby cats? Yeah. Yeah. Kittens. 

[00:06:23] Tony: Yeah. Where are we going with this? 

[00:06:25] Wayne: I'll tell you what, because it's been renovated. It's, they've had over a million dollars spent on it.

[00:06:30] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:06:31] Wayne: And it's called now After Hours. So. That's quite apt. So what's happened. And this has come across my desk and, you know, I get people to look at it and see whether it's worth. Your 

[00:06:42] Tony: entourage is checking out whether you should. 

[00:06:44] Wayne: It's come across my desk that it's been renovated. There's been a million dollars on it.

[00:06:48] Wayne: It's now called After Hours and the opening is this Saturday night. I'm going to have to go and have a look. 

[00:06:56] Tony: Just to test out the talent with your eyes. 

[00:06:57] Wayne: No, I'm going to, [00:07:00] because you're going to just, you know, give a little bit back to the, make sure 

[00:07:03] Tony: the Geelong boys are getting down there. So 

[00:07:05] Wayne: I'm going to go down and have a check out after hours and I can guarantee everyone one thing.

[00:07:10] Wayne: So if you're down at the, if you're down at, down in Geelong, come to after hours and check out. So 

[00:07:16] Tony: you're going to be there? 

[00:07:17] Wayne: I'm going to poke my head in for about seven hours. Ha ha ha ha Wait, everybody will want to know. Now listen to this, and by the way, Ben, you'll be there, I know that. You, you'll be, you'll be next to me.

[00:07:30] Wayne: Ah, don't know about that. Anyway, we're going to go, I'm going to go down and check 

[00:07:34] Tony: out. Now, Wayne, everyone wants to know, are you being paid a fee to go and have a look? 

[00:07:39] Wayne: It's, uh, it's private. We don't talk about that. Um, no, I'm not. I'm going down there to check it out. It's, uh, like I said, they've had a million dollars spent on the place, so I'm going to go and just Okay.

[00:07:51] Wayne: Uh, 

[00:07:51] Tony: Jess, where are you going, mate? Oh, it's Saturday night. 

[00:07:53] Wayne: Jess, you know where I'm going. They're quite classy. They can be quite classy. Let's get on to something a little bit more [00:08:00] serious. Yes. The MRO again. I'm talking Butters Banfield. Yes. Have you seen the incident? Many a times. Once again, didn't watch the whole game but I've seen these incidents.

[00:08:12] Wayne: That to me, now he hits, he hits, uh, Butters hits Banfield in the high with his bum. Goes in, uh, goes in to protect himself, side on. Banfield half heartedly puts his head over the ball and leans in. Now, if he goes at that ball the way he should have gone at the ball, then he doesn't get hit in the head. But because he went, like I said, half, half at it, that's why invariably that contact gets made to him.

[00:08:42] Wayne: By the way, that's my opinion and I'm sure plenty of people will let me know what they think. I've already put it out in the Twitter world and, um, had plenty of feedback on it. I keep saying this, that you have, you, it is, the onus is upon yourself to protect yourself. It's the same when people are coming back with the fly to the [00:09:00] ball and someone coming forward with the ball.

[00:09:01] Wayne: If you get hit, then that's a part of the game. If the other person coming forward with the footy or the ball's on the ground and you lead, you lead with your head. And, and don't go at it hard, then you will get hurt. And I get, and I get where we're protecting the head and actually we'll, we'll get onto all of that sort of stuff.

[00:09:22] Wayne: We're going to, we're going to talk about the players association and something, another, uh, another business, which is in the round. Yeah. Helping, um, players welfare after they retire, et cetera, et cetera. So we're going to talk about that a little bit later, but. But in terms of when you're in the battle, so when you play like you you do have to protect yourself.

[00:09:42] Tony: Yep. 

[00:09:43] Wayne: Yeah. 

[00:09:43] Tony: Do you think, um, Banfield is now scared of the repercussions of the MRO or you think he was scared because Butters was coming in eyes for the ball and knocked him out of the contest? I 

[00:09:55] Wayne: think there are times where players just put their head there because they're going to get a free kick. They know they're [00:10:00] going to get a free kick.

[00:10:00] Wayne: I'm not saying that's what Banfield did, but to me, he went at it, not in the manner, if I was coaching Banfield, I would say, if you went at that a bit harder, you wouldn't have got hit in the head. Yeah, 

[00:10:09] Tony: but it should be play on. Well, where is it? Where is the game going? 

[00:10:13] Wayne: Invariably he got hit in the head, Tony.

[00:10:15] Wayne: So it's not play on. I'm just saying that I don't think butters should be. getting suspended for that. 

[00:10:20] Tony: Neither do I, but David King made a really good point and said, are we saving for the brown load or are we saving for the head? 

[00:10:25] Wayne: Kingy for me has gone a little bit too far the other way. Kingy, Kingy's now the 

[00:10:31] Tony: What?

[00:10:31] Tony: Become the MRO police? Well, 

[00:10:34] Wayne: he's, well, I'll tell you what he's become. He's become the, uh, you know, oh boy, the head high police and, uh, you get hit head high. You know what? Let's see who can say 10 weeks, give him 10 weeks. Let's see who can get the bigger headline. Um, yeah. I was talking 

[00:10:49] Tony: about paraplegia last night on the, uh, on Fox footy.

[00:10:52] Wayne: So once again, let's see who gets the bigger headline. It's called, you know, it's called 

[00:10:58] Tony: Yeah, but unless you are deliberately [00:11:00] going for the opposition player's head, it should be play on. 

[00:11:02] Wayne: We're not talking about, you know, the 80s and the 90s and, you know, those times of footy. If you can't go at the ball now, if you go at the ball now and half poop yourself, Oh boy, because you are protected like never before, but you've still got to go at the ball and you still have an, like I said, an onus upon yourself to protect yourself when you go at the ball.

[00:11:25] Wayne: I don't know anyone, unless you're picking the ball up on a half volley, if that ball's there and you know, your vision, your vision, peripheral vision goes, far and wide. You know that a player's coming there, especially if you're both coming front on, you can see, you see the ball. I can still see that TV in front of me.

[00:11:42] Wayne: And you know that you're going to get there simultaneously. Guess what you do? You go like that and you turn, you protect yourself. You don't, you don't put your head down and go for the ball like that. If you know, you're going to get hit in the head. If they both do that, guess what they do? They both hit heads.

[00:11:56] Wayne: Yeah. And I fair say that's worse than hitting Both hitting [00:12:00] shoulders. Yeah. 

[00:12:00] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:12:00] Wayne: Correct. Anyway, it's not a puzzle. 

[00:12:02] Tony: Tackling is becoming conjecturous as well. Like we turned, turned last week, we saw Toby Green, the Giants captain, where he tackled Mac Andrew and flung him to the ground and he was let off.

[00:12:13] Tony: And then this week, I think it was Jordan, uh, it's Jordan Dawson from the Crows captain. Yeah. He's tackled somebody and now it's up for conjecture as to whether he should be suspended. 

[00:12:22] Wayne: Well, that's why people are getting turned off by the game because of the inconsistency that we have in it. And from one week to another, the, whether it be the holding the ball, whether it be the MRO.

[00:12:33] Tony: Score review. Score review. Oh, the score review's out of control. No, it 

[00:12:36] Wayne: is, it is, and I know we're having a bit of a 

[00:12:37] Tony: whinge, but this is why. Yeah, but so is it, the fan at home on the couch, in the pub, in the outer, they are all saying the same thing. That the score review system is ruining the game. 

[00:12:48] Wayne: You know what, Tony?

[00:12:50] Wayne: We've been saying every year I worked in the media. And we've got someone coming on that worked in the media for longer than what I have. Every single year we talk about the [00:13:00] same crap. It's the same issues year after year Okay, well why aren't we fixing them Wayne? But it doesn't, well 

[00:13:06] Tony: Thanks, Tony. Well, the score review system, now I'm going to Ben, you'll have to work out how to bleep this out, but Adam Simpson was clear as day yesterday waiting for a goal to be awarded, I think it was to Jamie Cripps or Petrocelli, and Adam Simpson said it in the box, fuck me, in terms of what the hell is going on, and why is it taking so long?

[00:13:25] Tony: Every game is now held up, so you're a lip leader now. I am. Is by a score review system. It is ruining the game. Players are turning around knowing they've kicked a goal because an umpire is now checking with the score review system as to whether it was touched, behind the line, by the player, whether it didn't hit the post or it did hit the post.

[00:13:45] Tony: It's ridiculous. Players are warming down and up in the quarters. 

[00:13:48] Wayne: Yeah, goal umpires are just about, they don't make a call anymore. 

[00:13:54] Tony: Is there technology to actually remove them from the game? No, they don't. 

[00:13:59] Wayne: Well, [00:14:00] they're going to the technology just about every choice they have. Unless it goes through post high through the middle.

[00:14:05] Wayne: Yeah. They're calling for it every time. Yeah. But they're, from what we read, not that I believe everything you read, but they're apparently being told to do that. So whether that's a sponsorship thing, I'm not sure. Yeah, but the 

[00:14:15] Tony: Athol needs to fix it. 

[00:14:16] Wayne: What about some of the coaches in the, uh, How do you reckon some of them are going?

[00:14:21] Wayne: You've got a strong opinion on Bevo? 

[00:14:24] Tony: Oh 

[00:14:24] Wayne: no, I 

[00:14:24] Tony: don't. I don't, look, I haven't, I don't even think I've met Luke Beveridge, but there was some I'm a big fan, for 

[00:14:30] Wayne: what it's 

[00:14:31] Tony: worth, I'm a big 

[00:14:31] Wayne: Luke Beveridge fan. Yeah, I think I took him to the His apprenticeship coach? I took them to the Holy Grail. I do have to agree though, I listened to his press conference.

[00:14:40] Wayne: Yep. After the game. Yeah. He was talking in riddles. He was. What did he say? Well, that's, I'd love to know. 

[00:14:48] Tony: Okay. 

[00:14:48] Wayne: Have you listened to it? 

[00:14:49] Tony: I listened to some of it. He, uh, he sounded like he was trying to bamboozle the media. 

[00:14:53] Wayne: Well, it's, look, the media, and there's portions of the media that, [00:15:00] you know, have seriously got no idea about footy.

[00:15:03] Wayne: Right, and then they report that due, and when they hear, you know, a Premiership coach talk the way he did on the weekend, they walk away. And I don't think it does him any face, because he's a very smart guy, like I said, I really like him. Bulldogs, you know, people are going, well, are they where they should be?

[00:15:22] Wayne: Um, you know, do they need to need to have a change? I'm not sure about it. I don't think you throw the baby out with the bathwater just yet. I think that he's only five games in exactly. Right. So, um, what about Clarko? I tweeted out last week that I loved Clarko's honesty about North Melbourne and where they're at.

[00:15:42] Wayne: And people, whenever I say anything about North, people, uh, seem to get emotional about it. I'm not emotional about these comments. I'm just purely talking, just because I played at the footy club doesn't mean, um, 

[00:15:53] Tony: beyond criticism, correct. 

[00:15:55] Wayne: Now I loved his open and honest view about what he was [00:16:00] trying to do last week.

[00:16:01] Wayne: This is last week. This isn't yesterday. Um, and I sort of listened to that and I thought, okay, you know that I love that. At least we know that, you know, you thought about that, but you tried that. It didn't work. That did. So I thought that's great. But how about now? As a, as a total team show a little bit of something called desire 

[00:16:21] Tony: and 

[00:16:22] Wayne: got a fair reaction for that.

[00:16:25] Wayne: It doesn't matter how old you are. It doesn't mean you can't chase, tackle, smother, and show the desire that I've, I've spoke about. I mean, we, we, we, we, we saw, uh, well, apparently, um, a team yesterday in West coast who had been, uh, You know, pretty average and they've come out and won a game against Richmond, who have been up and down, I get it, but still showing a little bit of, showing a little bit of ticker.

[00:16:50] Tony: They were good yesterday, West Coast, but just to digress for a moment, back on to North Melbourne and Hawthorne. Now they play for the Wooden Spoon this week. I reckon those two would, I'm [00:17:00] sure they're going to get a win, at least one win each, but it's going to be an interesting game this week. 

[00:17:05] Wayne: They'll at least get what?

[00:17:06] Tony: One game each win. 

[00:17:08] Wayne: They will at 

[00:17:10] Tony: least win one game. 

[00:17:11] Wayne: One unless it's a draw of a win this week. I'll tell you what, you're a genius. You are. Well, one team's going to win probably. No, no. What I 

[00:17:18] Tony: mean is they will at least have one win for the year. So that, but they will be playing off for the wooden spoon this week.

[00:17:25] Wayne: Oh boy. Well, it's Clarke O V Mitchell. I'm prepared to say this and I've said it millions of times before. Coaches, coaches, and everyone says we've got the best coach. Yes, he was a great coach. Hawthorne, four premierships. Coaches, coaches don't make teams. Teams make coaches. Simple as that. Did you make Dennis?

[00:17:46] Wayne: Of course I did, but not, but I'm, I'm one of 18 

[00:17:50] Tony: Parkin? 

[00:17:53] Wayne: Of course they did. 100 percent they did. They, you think about that team. Yeah. When we introduce [00:18:00] them soon, we'll, we'll. Two legends of the Kelton Footy Club? Absolutely. So, yeah, if you've got a good, if you need the cattle, and if you've got the cattle, then all of a sudden coaches look, Very, very good.

[00:18:11] Wayne: I have said this numerous times. Off the top of my head, I'll quickly do this. I think what Lee Matthews did at Collingwood in 1990 was far superior to what he did at Brisbane for the three peat. 

[00:18:22] Tony: Because of the plays? 

[00:18:23] Wayne: And I think what Mick Malthouse did at Collingwood when they lost the two grand finals against Brisbane was better than what he did at West Coast.

[00:18:32] Wayne: Because he had better cattle at West Coast than he had at Collingwood when they lost those two flags. So, coaches can make teams better, but invariably, the team makes the coach. So, and it's been proven correct. Look at Tom Brady. Yes. Walked away from Belichick, wins a Super Bowl, and Patriots haven't been anywhere since.

[00:18:53] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:18:54] Wayne: Proof's in the pudding. 

[00:18:55] Tony: Well, speaking of West Coast, did you see any of the game v. Richmond? We'll 

[00:18:59] Wayne: No, but I've [00:19:00] seen snippets of it. 

[00:19:01] Tony: Yeah, what did you think of the snippets? 

[00:19:03] Wayne: Which, I 

[00:19:05] Tony: just, I thought Harley Reid kicking his first goal on home soil yesterday was fantastic. And look, I know we spoke about this briefly prior to the program, but I still think there's a lot of Harley Reid in Chris Judd making those comparisons.

[00:19:21] Tony: even similar. Similar in height. 

[00:19:24] Wayne: Well, what's wrong with this? I'll tell you the similarities between Harley Reid and Chris Judd. 

[00:19:27] Tony: Oh yeah? 

[00:19:28] Wayne: They've both got two arms and two legs. Oh 

[00:19:30] Tony: yeah, well that's just, um, that's silly by you. 

[00:19:32] Wayne: Well, that's the similarities. They're different players. One's built like a brick shithouse as a young man.

[00:19:39] Tony: Yeah? 

[00:19:39] Wayne: And the other one was, was Grease Lightning. 

[00:19:41] Tony: Well you obviously didn't see the game yesterday then. Running away from Dustin Martin in the centre square. Kicking it up forward to Jake Waterman. 

[00:19:50] Wayne: Okay, if you think they're similarities then you know better than 

[00:19:52] Tony: me. I do. There's two centimetres difference in height.

[00:19:54] Wayne: Like I said, okay, so. Oh no, 

[00:19:57] Tony: I'm not going to argue with 

[00:19:58] Wayne: this. I want to hear the comparison. [00:20:00] Well 

[00:20:00] Tony: I think there is a lot of similarities. Dating back to Chris Judd in 2003 when he kicked those five goals against Brisbane. 

[00:20:06] Wayne: Both got two ears. 

[00:20:07] Tony: Oh yeah, here we go. Both got hair. No, 

[00:20:10] Wayne: Chris 

[00:20:11] Tony: didn't. 

[00:20:11] Wayne: Oh, you're an 

[00:20:12] Tony: idiot.

[00:20:12] Tony: Yeah. All right, well, you know what? You can rubbish this, but I think in the next 20 games or 19 games, I think there will be comparisons between Reed and Judd. Oh, 

[00:20:23] Wayne: why did we, why? See, this is another media toss off that you talk about. Everyone wants to compare, uh, Bluey, Snowy off the trams with, you know, Bluey off the trams.

[00:20:34] Wayne: Like, why? 

[00:20:35] Tony: Because that's what people want to talk about. Well, 

[00:20:37] Wayne: I don't think they do. Well, you need to get back on a tram then. Harley Reid's Harley Reid. Let him be Harley. Well, they've given him Ben Cousins number. 

[00:20:44] Tony: They obviously think the world of him. He's a number one draft pick. He was on the back page of the West Australian for 40 days straight.

[00:20:50] Tony: Hang on, hang on. 

[00:20:50] Wayne: It's Nick Natternewie's number, by the way. Everyone's forgotten about him. Does he play like Nick Nat? Does he play like him as well? 

[00:20:56] Tony: No, he's not quite as tall as Nick Nat. Alright, let's move on to something a [00:21:00] little bit more serious. You've had your opinion and rubbished mine? I should get that towel like you and uh, and just wring it out wet like you hung me out to dry last week.

[00:21:08] Wayne: Alright, something a little bit more serious, because this is close to home. 

[00:21:11] Tony: Oh yeah? Uh, what? Now don't tell me, are we going to talk about the Players Association? 

[00:21:16] Wayne: Yes, you knew exactly what we were going to talk about, because, you know what? Look, every year, I wrote an article, as you know, about the Players Association about a year and a half ago, in the H, right, and it got a lot of, I got a lot of feedback, and a lot of it was from the Players Association, and Paul Marsh, who I've spoken to numerous times, Tim Harrington, who works there, um, Were they defensive?

[00:21:40] Wayne: Well, I called them the toothless tiger, so, What, 

[00:21:43] Tony: plural or singular? 

[00:21:44] Wayne: I 

[00:21:44] Tony: don't know, you're the, you're the academic. What, well, the toothless tiger, you talking about one person or the organisation? Yeah, well, the organisation, alright? Well, you know, Paul Marsh is on a three month sabbatical. Is he? Yes. It was, uh, they sent out a release last week, which I sent to you, to your email.

[00:21:59] Tony: [00:22:00] Why, 

[00:22:00] Wayne: why, why is he going on three month holiday, uh, 

[00:22:03] Tony: in the middle of the foot of year? Well, I can't answer that. It's just only what the release said. 

[00:22:07] Wayne: Okay. So you don't know why? 

[00:22:09] Tony: No. 

[00:22:09] Wayne: Okay. Well, clearly there's a reason why. Good luck to him. I hope he's sunning himself somewhere. In the Bahamas? Well, uh, who, who cares where it is?

[00:22:17] Wayne: If he's on a holiday, he's on a holiday, but let's talk about the association because it's close to home. I had a conversation with Tim Harrington only. A few weeks ago. Yeah. He's 

[00:22:25] Tony: your former teammate. 

[00:22:26] Wayne: Apparently. He was our Fords coach too for five years. And I didn't even know Tim's a good bloke, Wayne? No, he's a good bloke.

[00:22:33] Wayne: But he said to me, he said, you know, I was your Fords coach. I said, really? I thought you were the video. I thought he was the video guy. Oh, 

[00:22:39] Tony: no need for that. I, 

[00:22:41] Wayne: I, I don't say anything about anyone. I wouldn't say to them I said this to Tim. 

[00:22:45] Tony: Yeah. Okay. 

[00:22:46] Wayne: He's starting to look more like the doctor off back to the future.

[00:22:48] Wayne: He's got long 

[00:22:49] Tony: hair. 

[00:22:50] Wayne: Well, anyway, so let's talk, let's be serious for a second. So I rang him, so, well documented, had a shoulder replacement in June last year, [00:23:00] right? I've also had this shoulder reconstructed twice, so this may very well need a replacement going forward. So I spoke to Tim about what the Players Association Um, does for someone, you know, in my situation, obviously, um, they picked up the gap.

[00:23:18] Wayne: Um, if you, you, you, medical health, not everyone's got private health by the way, but I had private health, so that pays for the operation. And then there's a gap, which is play association fixed up. So that's a part of what, that's a service. And you were the AFL in the history of the game. It's a service that they offer.

[00:23:34] Wayne: And that's whether you play one game, 200 games, 300 games or 50, whatever it is, right? So, I rang him in regards to needing some treatment on this shoulder to prevent me from having a shoulder replacement on this arm. He said we don't, we don't look after anything to do with prevention. So even though it's in medical records to suggest that I've had shoulder reconstructions and therefore and [00:24:00] sustained from playing North Melbourne clearly and yes, and It's not not prevention.

[00:24:06] Wayne: It's after I get the operation then they will help me I would have thought that's back the front. 

[00:24:12] Tony: Yeah, I agree with that. Especially 

[00:24:13] Wayne: with something as serious as that. 

[00:24:15] Tony: We've played 272 

[00:24:18] Wayne: games. Obviously there's concussion, there's all of the things. Mental health. The amount, the amount of lawsuits that are going, not only are happening right now, with the AFL, but are going to happen in the future.

[00:24:32] Wayne: They have to get this right. 

[00:24:33] Tony: Who will the Players Association back in this class action? 

[00:24:38] Wayne: Who will they, well, surely they, they back the players. 

[00:24:40] Tony: Well, surely would be the operative word, but I'm not sure that they would. The AFL funds them to something like at least 10 million a year. Which 

[00:24:47] Wayne: has always been a concern of mine.

[00:24:49] Wayne: I think they're, they sleep very comfortably next to the AFL. Yeah. And I think they sleep, In actual fact, they're spooning. That's a very good analogy. Well, that's [00:25:00] my opinion. Yeah. I think they spoon the AFL a little bit too much. And I think that if, to be a proper union, You can't be spooning your, you know, 

[00:25:09] Tony: employer.

[00:25:09] Tony: Well, it's like you said off camera, it's a bit like the CFMEU being in bed with the government. 

[00:25:14] Wayne: I would have 

[00:25:15] Tony: thought. But in terms of the players association and the players and the AFL, the AFL has done this remarkably well. It's genius by them, but in terms of the players, they should actually turn around and say, we want 20 a more each from the player group, say 800 players to make it independent of the AFL to become a proper union.

[00:25:36] Wayne: Which is why we've got two special guests coming up to talk about a, uh, well, well, a, a business that is going in that exact direction. 400 games between them for Carlton. It's called, uh, the fifth quarter and we will get them on right now. Well, here we are. one. Now. Unlike me to make a mistake and call these next two gentlemen that are [00:26:00] involved in a business because it's not a business Tony It's a non for profit organization that well that looks after past players and like to welcome Mark McClure and Kenny Hunter who as You said off the top Tony Legends of the Carlton Footy Club, Legends of the AFL.

[00:26:17] Wayne: Grew up watching these two gentlemen. You know what, I love it when old timers come. They make me actually feel a little bit younger than what I am. Oh really? Although they're not that much older. But you two heard what I just had to say about the Players Association and the difficulties of, you know, what happens there.

[00:26:34] Wayne: And, you know, and that's not just me. That's my personal experience. But also, um, They have done a lot of good things. We know that. Tell us a little bit about the fifth quarter. 

[00:26:47] Ken: Okay, um, thanks. Thanks, Doc, for having us on, Tony. Um, fifth quarter started with me and Kenny Sheldon, actually, back in, um, 2021. And we made a not, uh, not for profit, uh, in [00:27:00] that time.

[00:27:00] Ken: Because we all know that people who struggle beyond sport, and particularly from, um, AFL football, Uh, now, we all know that when people leave the game that, um, you know, they can lose their identity, their purpose, and they're vulnerable, and a lot of people make poor decisions, uh, when they're in that situation, and that can then lead to mental illness and sadly suicide, and we've seen that.

[00:27:22] Ken: So we thought that, you know, over the years we thought, you know, we've got to be better than this as an industry, can't we, can't we be better than what we're doing? So I did a bit of study and I looked at, um, uh, what the NFL were doing in 2007, the NFL Team owners, the NFL Hall of Fame, the NFL Players Association, created the NFL Player Care Foundation, a not for profit organisation.

[00:27:45] Ken: For past players? For past players. So, um, with all this, I thought, well, I'll go to the AFL and speak to them about it, and to the AFLPA. So I went to the AFL, and basically they said, well, You know, I understand what you're saying Ken, but um, [00:28:00] you know, that's why we give all the money for the AFL absolving yourself of your responsibility by saying that.

[00:28:07] Ken: So I went off to the AFL PR and they said, well a lot of the services that you say you can provide, we already do. And I said, well do you? And they said yeah. And I said, well do you get placed jobs? And they said no. Well, do you have a relationship with Dementia Australia or Parkinson's? They said no, and I said, well you don't do everything.

[00:28:22] Ken: I said, plus, you know, you have to play one senior game to get the benefits of, the AFL player benefits when you retire. So there's a lot of kids out there and families that, when they get turfed out of the system, they might have been there for two or three years but haven't played that senior game, they've got nowhere to go.

[00:28:37] Ken: So, unfortunately you've got all these, people and kids and former players out there that just don't have a place to go to and get support and knowledge about where they can go and get this sort of support. And that's the reason we started it. 

[00:28:51] Tony: So you would like the fifth quarter to be an extension of the Players Association?

[00:28:55] Ken: Uh, uh, uh, We basically see it as, you know, there's the AFL, the [00:29:00] AFL the clubs, and then we'd be out to the right to be an additional, uh, um, service, as like a safety net for those players that fall through the crack. Because we know that, you know, when players, most of them get sacked from the club. So the last place they want to go back to, uh, you know, in that situation if they need help, they won't go back to the club, the club that sacked them.

[00:29:22] Ken: So where do they go? So there's really nowhere for them to go. 

[00:29:24] Wayne: Mark, tell us about how you got involved in the fifth quarter and, and, and just to back up what you said there, Kenny, um, You're right, the forgotten ones are guys that can be in a club system, Sellers. Yep. And be in that system for five or six years, they mightn't play a game, and then all of a sudden they're out and the job, I've said for years, a recruiting, a job recruiter, um, I tell you what, they're motivated, they're generally, you know, obviously dedicated at a particular sport, you know, they'd be pretty good employees, I would have [00:30:00] thought.

[00:30:00] Mark: Well let me tell you something, how did you feel when you finished? 

[00:30:03] Wayne: Uh, lost. 

[00:30:05] Mark: There you go. Well these people are broken down and busted. And, uh, and finished at that time. And you're a star in the game, alright? So when they're not that, how do you think they're going? They can't get a job, they can't do this, they can't do that.

[00:30:16] Mark: And I think that's the most important thing, uh, for people to do. Is give them some hope to actually keep going as a human in life, you know? They've got families, they've got kids, they've got all those things that everyone's got. And, uh, who's been looking after him? I can't tell you. 

[00:30:35] Wayne: So there's players, being the devil's advocate, and there's people out there that say, oh, you know, they're on the club.

[00:30:40] Wayne: What, people still don't understand that only 5 percent of players, 5%, so Reece Stanley on the weekend, who by the way has been up and down in his career, he becomes one of the 5 percent of players that play 200 games. Yeah. It's unbelievable to think that. Yeah. But people just think they're on big money.

[00:30:56] Wayne: They get paid this. They, they hear the, the, the top dollar [00:31:00] and only hear about what we're talking about right now. 

[00:31:03] Ken: Yeah. Well, that's right. Now, I think with us is with the fifth quarter, we're a not for profit and we're all working voluntarily and we've got a lot of people from the community involved as well.

[00:31:12] Ken: Uh, but the hardest thing I think is exactly that, Duck, is that, you know, people think that AFL players have got plenty of money and the AFL got plenty of money and they should be paying for this. But in reality, you know, we're, we're a, we've got DGR status and we're a not for profit so we, we've got to go out there and try and get companies involved to try and help us to help the past players.

[00:31:31] Ken: Uh, because I don't think we're going to get any help from the AFL or the AFLPA. 

[00:31:34] Tony: Kenny, how many AFL clubs have 

[00:31:36] Ken: you spoken with? Uh, I've spoken with quite a few of the past player groups and, uh, we're currently putting out a survey, uh, to all the past players through their past player groups. Um, so far we've had about, um, five come back and, and it's been really positive.

[00:31:51] Ken: So five clubs, five clubs, um, with their surveys. So what we're trying to do is, obviously we got to a point where we thought, well, look, we're building this, [00:32:00] but what do the past players think? Well, we thought, well, let's go and ask them. So that's why we put out the survey. So we're hoping then the survey can validate a lot of the things that we're, we're trying to do.

[00:32:09] Ken: And we've got some actually data to back that up. 

[00:32:11] Tony: Is the survey digital, that the players can go to? 

[00:32:14] Ken: Yes, it is on, um, SurveyMonkey and we send it out and um What's the website, just for all the players that are listening? And they can jump on? Well, it'll be sent out by the pass by group, by the club. So 

[00:32:24] Tony: they can't independently 

[00:32:25] Ken: go and do it and 

[00:32:26] Tony: check out the 

[00:32:26] Ken: survey and Well, there's a lot there that um, there's some clubs that have said no, but um, we'll be able to send pass players from those clubs if they want to, if they just hook onto Fifth Quarter, which is spelled F I F T H Q T R dot com dot au, or dot org dot au, sorry.

[00:32:42] Ken: Um, there's a place where they can get information from. Um, but just on, on all this that we're speaking about, there is, um, you know, Peter Venables, um, his son, Dan, played at the West Coast Eagles. And in, um, 2019, I think it was, after he played in a premiership on a [00:33:00] young kid. He got knocked out unconscious, uh, playing against Melbourne at the West Coast.

[00:33:05] Ken: Uh, his wife, his girlfriend at the time, drove him home. He thought his head was going to explode. Uh, got, went to hospital the next day and had seven brain bleeds. Um, so, he, this young kid hasn't been able to play, you know, footy again. Basically, he hasn't been able to work, does some study, but really struggles.

[00:33:23] Ken: And, and this is a kid that comes from a really solid family. You know, he's tried to better himself and he hasn't been able to get better. So unfortunately, through this system, where they, you would think that the AFL and the industry would sit down with this family and try and work it through. It looks like now that they're forced into going to court, which is going to cost them a lot of money.

[00:33:43] Ken: So, you know, and they don't want to do that. You know, I mean, they're football people, but they're getting pushed into that position that they've got no choice. And I understand Peter Venables, if it was my son I'd be doing the same thing. So it's going to cost them a lot of money to do this, but they've got no choice.

[00:33:58] Wayne: So he's, so [00:34:00] clearly that's a football incident. Yeah, so playing AFL footy and he's now, you're saying that the only choice that the family's got is to actually go to court against the very organization that, so that, that, that's where, that's where the system is, is absolutely broken. Well, broken. You know, that, that, that's as obvious as a nose on your face that we, we say, okay, this is, this has happened.

[00:34:27] Wayne: We look after that, surely? 

[00:34:29] Ken: Yeah, it was clear as day, I was there. Well, it's on camera. And apparently he had tests prior to that. So there's a baseline where you show that through the TAC, that he didn't have any damage from, you know, he had this concussion, which is clear as day. It's what happened to the kid.

[00:34:45] Ken: So, that's just one example, Ducker. Yeah. There's lots of other people out there. Well, what 

[00:34:50] Tony: about you two? In terms of you two played, you know, 400 games in between you, three premierships. Um, are you speaking to contemporaries about their [00:35:00] struggles in life in the wake of AFL career? 

[00:35:03] Ken: Well, you do, you do hear and you do speak to a lot of guys.

[00:35:06] Ken: A lot of guys have got, you know, pain management issues. Um, obviously from, um, um, hits and operations that they've had over the years. Um, and I, I, I, myself and Siles will be the same, we won't be the same, we've got knocked out plenty of times ourselves. And, you know, um, I, I made the decision to donate my brain to science a few years ago to the, um, you know, Sports Brain Bank.

[00:35:27] Ken: Um, but, you know, I'm sure that at some point in time that I might suffer from it just as much as the next person, but obviously there are people out there that we do see and know that have copped it pretty bad and, and you can't ignore what they've gone through to get to that point, I don't think.

[00:35:44] Mark: Sometimes it takes a few, a few years because deterioration starts. And everybody at some stages of their life, 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s and some people are less. Yep, 40s. 40s, you know what I mean? I mean that is a dangerous part of their life at 40 years of age your [00:36:00] brain starts to Yeah, 

[00:36:00] Tony: to 

[00:36:01] Ken: degenerate.

[00:36:01] Mark: Degenerate, yeah. So to me that's all part of it. 

[00:36:04] Ken: Yeah, that's right. Well, all the degenerative diseases like CTE and, um, you know, Parkinson's and dementia can all be attributed to head knocks, you know, um, you only have to Google up on that. It's not 

[00:36:20] Mark: a pretty place to play. It's difficult. It's hard. The rules, uh, they, they, you know, I mean, you were talking about it before, putting your heads in down underneath.

[00:36:28] Mark: I mean, that is a dangerous thing to do for people, but they're brave enough to do it. Sometimes they do it well and get it right, but sometimes they do it wrong. How 

[00:36:36] Tony: are you guys feeling? Individually? 

[00:36:39] Mark: Ah, well I've been having some tests myself, to tell you the truth. Over the last sort of, uh, four months, three or four months, Had a heap of stuff, you know.

[00:36:47] Mark: On your 

[00:36:48] Tony: brain or your body? 

[00:36:49] Mark: Well, I couldn't find a brain. 

[00:36:51] Tony: Don't undersell yourself, Sellers. No, 

[00:36:53] Mark: but, uh, on my brain and, uh, around concussions and all that sort of stuff. Uh, it's a, it's scary. It's a [00:37:00] scary little business, you know. You've got to come up and stand up and try and talk about things and you forget things and you do that.

[00:37:05] Mark: So, look, it's, it's, it's difficult. And difficult to handle for your wife and your kids and all those things around you. It's a, it's a hard caper and, uh, And I think that the fifth quarter is a breath of fresh air because, well you know what? There's not an issue about, we're not going to look after you. No, the issue is we will look after you.

[00:37:24] Mark: That's the point. And that's what we want to do. And I think that's the most important thing. 

[00:37:28] Wayne: I think the hardest thing for me, and you know this, I know it was a long time since we all played, but when you're in the moment, When you're there and you're playing, you do, you think you're indestructible, nothing can hurt you, you do anything to get back, you know, all of those things.

[00:37:45] Wayne: And, you know, the fifth quarter, It comes along and says, you know, boys, this is something really important. Get behind this, support this. I think for the, for current players, they, they're that, they're that programmed about what they're, they're trying to [00:38:00] achieve and where they're trying to get to, which is why they struggle in jobs when they finish.

[00:38:05] Wayne: They don't, they're not even thinking about anything like this. It's when, it's as soon as you know, time's up, then you start thinking about, Oh dear, what am I going to do now? And then you start thinking about all of these injuries, uh, that, that website. And when you go to the clubs, is that message getting out to the park?

[00:38:23] Wayne: Cause a lot of clubs have it now. I know North Melbourne have just started. Um, I think Puma Harvey might be in charge of the past players now at North. So. That this message has gotta go to Boomer Harvey, and then he sends it out to all the past players, not the current, the past players. Is that, is that the angle that you're taking, Kenny?

[00:38:40] Ken: Yeah, absolutely. Yep. And you should get something this week, I think, from North Melbourne, right? Yep. 'cause we've gone out and spoken to their past players. Yep. And they're very good too, by the way. But that, that's, that's the whole thing, is that we we're trying to support those past player groups because, um, a lot of them, a lot of the blokes who work on the past players, it's all voluntary, you know?

[00:38:58] Ken: Um. I can 

[00:38:59] Wayne: [00:39:00] guarantee if Boom is there it won't be voluntary. 

[00:39:02] Ken: But, yeah, if someone's got an issue, it's, you know, it's really hard and I think, um, and that's why we want to give this service to people so they've got an option that they can go to where they don't feel embarrassed, it's independent, and people won't know what they're doing, it's all confidential and stuff like that.

[00:39:21] Ken: But I think you're right Wayne, is that when people do come in, finish playing. It's a big issue. Um, is that, you know, they miss that adrenaline, the rush of, you know, playing at a higher level. Uh, they miss the camaraderie that they've got with their former teammates. They miss the structure that's around them.

[00:39:39] Ken: And then the support that goes with it. And then you wake up one day and it's gone. And it's a really difficult thing for people nowadays to cope with. And all of a sudden you could go from 100, 000 a year to 50, 000. 

[00:39:52] Tony: Well now it's probably double that. Yeah, double that. So what's the biggest gripe from former players to you two about [00:40:00] What are you guys doing?

[00:40:03] Mark: Well there's a bit of pick and choose, that's what I see. I've heard from people, players have gone in there, Are they, how are they going to help us, what's going to go on there, how can they help me as a person, all those sorts of things. And I think that's the biggest problem. Oh you know, so some bloke gets this much money and this one doesn't get that.

[00:40:20] Mark: It's not about money. It's about actual health. That's what it's about. Money doesn't mean one thing, uh, to anybody after you've finished. It's about how your health is. And, we've got a lot of unhealthy blokes out there, I can tell you. Won't even put their hand up. I don't want to ostracise 

[00:40:36] Tony: one, but I mean, Sam Fisher.

[00:40:37] Tony: Mental health demons, and look where he is. 

[00:40:40] Ken: Yeah, yeah, and that's one, I suppose, is that, But, you know, for someone like Sam Fisher, Fifth Quarter existed, he could, um, we could reach out to him, or Sam could reach out to his, and we could help him. And perhaps that early intervention before you even get to that point, you do lose, uh, go out of the game and you are vulnerable.

[00:40:58] Ken: Uh, that there is a place that can [00:41:00] help you, um, before we get to that. 

[00:41:01] Tony: Yeah, Kenny, could you be, um, hypothetically a go between, between Fisher and St Kilda to help him understand why they sacked him and what St Kilda can do to better him as a human afterwards? Yeah, sure. I think, I think, 

[00:41:15] Ken: um, we've got enough people in our network now to, to try and help.

[00:41:19] Ken: Um, we had a, a, a guy from an ex Collingwood player that rang me who got this survey, uh, had my phone number and, um, Yeah, he's a 55 year old guy, and um, he was a bit lost, uh, didn't know he wanted a career change. So all of a sudden, I put him straight on to a, uh, a professional organi Organisational psychologist that I knew, that specialises in this stuff, so bang, straight away he was in.

[00:41:43] Ken: Did he have to pay? No, it was all free. None of us are getting paid, we're all voluntary, volunteers, so. We'd like to get in a position where we can employ a CEO of some sort, uh, and then have a physical place where people can come to, like a drop in centre and get information and support through [00:42:00] that way.

[00:42:00] Ken: It's a no 

[00:42:02] Wayne: brainer for me. I mean, you know, I mean, it's, you know, the AFL Players Association, the AFL, um, you know, rather than, you know, turn a blind eye. I mean, it's a bit like, you know, the concussion discussion. You've just got to be taking all, all of the help on that you can. Yeah. 

[00:42:21] Mark: We've actually put out a thing towards the clubs and said we're If you put down any members and as a, can you add 10 to the membership and that goes to, uh, to the particular AFL club, you know, to the particular AFL club to work on and keep helping their players from the past.

[00:42:37] Mark: That's the key. So if you're Collingwood, $10. Well, it's a coffee. It's a coffee, it's 

[00:42:42] Wayne: one, it's you a coffee know they've got a hundred 

[00:42:44] Mark: thousand members. It's a coffee, it's a million bucks. You know what I mean? That's huge. 

[00:42:48] Wayne: Yeah. 

[00:42:48] Mark: Yeah. That's a big thing. So all, all those things go, go together as well. And they go back to their club because they like them sometimes.

[00:42:54] Mark: And they, they were there forever. And some people don't, but some do 

[00:42:58] Ken: and they get help. No, you're [00:43:00] right. And I think the, the clubs now to look at, need to look at, um, most of the clubs don't have a, a full-time person looking after this. You know, Shane Ossoff perhaps, um, and now Gavin Krasiska at him. But each club really needs to have that vocal point, that is a permanent person, that can look after Good job for you, Duck.

[00:43:17] Ken: Yeah, look after past players. 

[00:43:19] Wayne: Well, um, this is, um, this is my mainstream media expanded and I know I'm, I'm, I want to sell them. I totally, I get it. I get it. And you nailed it at, you know, there are blokes out there that have long careers that are lost. So imagine those that don't. And, and it's not that, like you said, the head injuries, whatever, whatever it may be.

[00:43:42] Wayne: The fact that you've got a, an organization that is there to help, I mean, you know, you have to be stupid not to get behind this and all the past players and, and it's up to, by the way, it's up to these past players to, to put their hand up and actually talk about [00:44:00] it and stand up. You're not weak because you, because you're vulnerable.

[00:44:04] Wayne: I think that's the one thing is men sell us. I mean, we, you know, we're from here. If you, if you say you're a little bit weak or you, you need help. You know, it's like you're a failure and unfortunately that's that stigma still that stigma still remains and we've just got to get out of that headspace and we've got to, you know, we've got to, you know, put our hand up, support one another and get behind one another and, and, and really make sure that, you know, this stuff and, and because let's be honest, it's not there.

[00:44:31] Wayne: It's not, they're going to probably help us. It's that next group coming through. And for all of those current players. Trust me, trust me, that Paddy Dangerfield, who's the President of the Players Association, and Joel Selwood, who's just retired, guarantee you in 10 years, they'll be feeling the effects that, that, that you, so, so, you know, really important that those guys realise, they mightn't be feeling the effects now, but realise that it'll come, get behind it.

[00:44:59] Mark: We've [00:45:00] also talked to Nicole Livingston about the women, and I think that's very important. Of course. Because they, they, when you watch them play football. They don't duck in the right spots. Talk about courage. You know what I mean? Yeah, they do. They just go straight at it and all of a sudden they do get hurt.

[00:45:12] Mark: So there's a bit of that going on and a bit of training on how to, how to actually actually go to the ball. You know, so those sorts of things. So, she's very happy to do it. She wants to be a part of it. Great. I think that's a really good thing. 

[00:45:22] Tony: Great. The other thing is to, without simplifying it, but I mean, we've all got a big network.

[00:45:27] Tony: Is it as simple as some of the old boys just wanting to actually be acknowledged to go back to a game and have a free meal at the MCG? Just to know that they're still alive? Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:45:36] Ken: There's a bit of that, but I think what we want to do as well is go back to the community where it all started and try and help them with past players.

[00:45:44] Ken: So we're going to trial a fifth quarter mental health and wellbeing game at a club this year. And I've also had a country town that would like us to take it to them as well. Uh, and, and it could be massive. I mean, I think we can make a big difference with mental health and wellbeing out in the communities.[00:46:00] 

[00:46:00] Ken: Uh, because we've all been there. We've all got experiences. We've all got stories. And they'd love to hear it out in the community. If there's sponsors out there that would like to get behind us, uh, we certainly need all the help that we can get. We need all the help that we can get from past players, and uh, we need all the help that we can get from respective past sponsors.

[00:46:18] Tony: Yeah, well we can put up your social medias, your uh, websites, and they can get on at WayneCare with the truth hurts, and we can put them in touch with you guys, so anything you need. 

[00:46:27] Mark: Look, you know, we really should join up with the AFL sometime, try and get some common ground between the two of us, because we can't fight with them, there's no value in trying to fight with them.

[00:46:37] Mark: No, it's not about fighting, it's about 

[00:46:39] Wayne: supporting one another, 

[00:46:41] Mark: how 

[00:46:41] Wayne: many cancer organisations are there out there? There's a lot of different organisations that have to invariably come together and fight together, it's the same, same with this, um, and, and, uh, well done by the way. 

[00:46:54] Tony: But without, without you three, there's not a 5.

[00:46:57] Tony: 2 billion dollar TV rights deal. [00:47:00] So everything that you guys worked for, the current crop of players are reaping the benefits. 

[00:47:05] Ken: Yeah, it's for every kid that's lived their dream and tried to play AFL footy and might not have got there, but um, yeah, they're suffering because of it. Can you imagine the 

[00:47:13] Mark: guys who played in the 60s?

[00:47:15] Mark: in the fifties and how they're going. Yeah. It'd be worse. Yep. 10 times worse. So we, nobody recognizes them. That's the point. Yep. 

[00:47:24] Wayne: All right. Thanks very much for joining us on the show. Kenny. It was great to have you on. 

[00:47:28] Ken: Great to be here. Appreciate it. 

[00:47:30] Wayne: How good was that having to, uh, Carlton legends have a chat about, uh, well, the situation that we're in with, You know, the ex, ex players and what they're going through, surely the AFL Players Association and the AFL come together with organisations like the Fifth Quarter.

[00:47:45] Tony: We hope so. We hope that there can be a joining of the forces, so it works well for them. 

[00:47:50] Wayne: I don't know about you, but you, you look like you're a bit of a kid in a candy store. 

[00:47:55] Tony: What's this analogy one? Where are we going? I've got a 

[00:47:57] Wayne: beautiful, two legends, two [00:48:00] legends, my jacket from Sydney, Carlton legends sitting in the room 

[00:48:03] Tony: Yeah 

[00:48:05] Wayne: You know, Kenny Hunter, war number nine, Mark McClure, war number 36.

[00:48:09] Wayne: I get You still feel in awe of blokes like that. They played footy in an era, well that, when I was a kid. They were, they were unbelievable. I know you're about 10 years older than I 

[00:48:19] Tony: am, but I grew up watching these blokes on Channel 7 as a young boy, and was just, I thought they were gods. I was a South Melbourne supporter growing up, right?

[00:48:29] Wayne: Who was your favourite player? Stevie Wright, little red headed rover. Did he win number 26? Yes, he did. Yeah. And my first game, My first, so, never been out of Wagga before, made the combined team, Big M, Big M Little League, that was, combined Wagga team, we wore South Melbourne colours, and we went to Princess Park to play at half time of Sydney v Carlton.

[00:48:54] Wayne: And you know what the highlight was? I'll never forget. Running out? You had, well, no, you say you had, you know, [00:49:00] Sellers and Hunter and Wayne Johnson and all these superstars. The Dominator. All these superstars. Big Mike, Fitzpatrick. And then, 

[00:49:06] Tony: and then Gerard Healy and the 

[00:49:08] Wayne: Wing. Oh, unbelievable, right? And so, as you, as you imagine.

[00:49:11] Wayne: Did Katherine play that day? No, and we're all thinking, We're all thinking, oh, how good's this? And you know, you think everyone's watching, you know, then you've realised later that everyone goes to get their pie and their beer in the afternoon. But it was just unbelievable. You know what the biggest thrill was?

[00:49:24] Wayne: Not seeing all those guys. Tony Barber, the star of this show. He was in the crowd and we spotted him, we've gone, he's Tony Barber. Oh, we were that excited that we saw Tony Barber. Well, he was the 

[00:49:38] Tony: biggest thing since sliced bread when we were growing up. It was, it is. It's great 

[00:49:43] Wayne: seeing 

[00:49:43] Tony: those guys. Hey, just before we start your next conversation, why would Stevie Wright be your favourite player if you were a big 6 foot 4 centre half forward and Stevie Wright was a ruck rover?

[00:49:53] Wayne: Because when I was 10 I wasn't 6 foot 4. 

[00:49:56] Tony: No, but I thought you would have aspired for some of the bigger [00:50:00] boys. 

[00:50:00] Wayne: I was a midfielder and I was a skinny little twerp. Were you? Yeah. You must have had some big enemies. You know why I liked him? I loved him. Because he was quick? Tough? No, no. Because he, he pulled me aside at a clinic in Wagga Wagga and took me aside, obviously saw something special and had Oh my God.

[00:50:17] Wayne: And had a, and had a kick with me. Really had it just to pull me aside. He wouldn't remember I have said this publicly before but had a kick with me and from that time on I fell in love with him I wore 26 in my first state of origin game for New South Wales You know in 19 in reference to Stevie Roy in reference to Stevie, right?

[00:50:34] Wayne: Became one of my favorite numbers because of him 

[00:50:37] Tony: and then Barry's just going to 

[00:50:38] Wayne: show you what sort of influence you can have By doing that just pulling a kid aside. I'll never forget that and on New South Wales 

[00:50:46] Tony: Well now you give him a real nice story I remember waiting outside the Hawthorne rooms when I was a little kid, and Terry Wallace brushed me.

[00:50:53] Tony: And this is when he was a star, wearing leather pants, had the solarium. He brushed you? He brushed me. I said, [00:51:00] Terry, can I get a He goes, oh, sorry, mate. So you know who came out next? Rodney signed an autograph, number 26, loved the Rocket. 

[00:51:08] Wayne: Oh, so you had, oh, for the same reason. 

[00:51:10] Tony: Oh, but the Rocket was a little gun, they were a gun team.

[00:51:13] Tony: Oh, one of my favourite players was Phil Walsh at Collingwood, Peter Moore, um, and then the Hawthorne boys, Rocket, you know, Dermot, and then Terry Wallace, Brushme, and then So you're a 

[00:51:21] Wayne: Hawthorne supporter? 

[00:51:22] Tony: No, well, I loved VFL, but, 

[00:51:25] Wayne: uh While we're talking about New South Wales, quickly, we'll finish on, um, they've got a Hall of Fame coming up.

[00:51:31] Tony: They 

[00:51:31] Wayne: do. On the 3rd of May. 

[00:51:33] Tony: Obviously in Sydney. 

[00:51:35] Wayne: Yeah, it's New South Wales, so. 

[00:51:37] Tony: Obviously in Sydney, yes. 

[00:51:39] Wayne: Well, it could be anywhere in New South Wales. But no, it's being held in Sydney on the 3rd of May. They're, um, inducting people into the, uh, New South Wales Football Hall of Fame. And this is their inaugural 

[00:51:48] Tony: dinner.

[00:51:48] Wayne: And I reckon that, uh, the man there, Mark McClure. Our previous guest, Sellers, yep. I reckon he'd be a fair chance. I'd, I'd Well, he grew up in, um, Sydney. I'm actually going up for it. I'd love to, I'd love to see some old Hang [00:52:00] on, say that again. I'd I'd love to see some go back 

[00:52:02] Tony: one 

[00:52:03] Wayne: go back. I'm I'm going up there to see who's inducted.

[00:52:05] Wayne: Oh, just as I uh, I'm going up there to see because I want to as a guest. There'll be guys that I grew up with. Yep That were legends of the Riverina League. Yep, Paul Kelly, not just all Paul Kelly's and I would imagine he'd be automatic Yep, Sydney Premiership captain It wasn't a Premiership. Sorry, Sydney captain.

[00:52:25] Wayne: Unfortunately, uh, you know, they lost that one. Oh, in 96, sorry. He was a, he was a grand final captain and an absolute legend. But guys like, there's a guy, Tex Walker's dad, Wayne Walker. Like, he was an absolute superstar of, of, of that league and superstar played in all the interleague games. Then there's guys like Laurie Pendrick, who was my hero growing up, played, I don't know how many games, but he went up to Sydney then, you know, thought stuff, this city life, but he was a, he was a legend.

[00:52:55] Wayne: So all of those sorts of people will be at this induction. Um, it's going to be [00:53:00] a ripper. I can't wait to get on it. Do you know 

[00:53:01] Tony: what the, um, What the induction process is. No idea. Played there, lived there, born there. No idea. No idea. 

[00:53:08] Wayne: All that I know is that I'd imagine Mark's going up. Yep. And, uh, and, and guys that I just mentioned, Paul Kelly is an obvious one.

[00:53:17] Wayne: Yeah, 

[00:53:18] Tony: last week you made reference to me in my umbrella about being a penguin. Yeah. You know, going out and buying a penguin suit, are you, for your next trip to Sydney? 

[00:53:27] Wayne: Oh, you mean a tuxedo? Yes. I'm not sure whether it's black tie. Actually, I'll have to check and see. But anyway, that's enough of the truth hurts.

[00:53:36] Wayne: Um, it was a fantastic episode. Well, you know what? I'll tell you what it was. It was a meaningful episode. And let's hope once again, let's hope that there's some synergy between those two. Let's hope there's more synergy between those two than there is. Well, Tony, talk about some exciting news. Uh, we've got some exciting news because, uh, you wouldn't believe it.

[00:53:55] Wayne: This is breaking news, isn't it? Well, the truth, it is breaking news. Bigger than, uh, me having the [00:54:00] four week suspension. Oh, 

[00:54:01] Tony: yes, thank you to the, uh That was pretty 

[00:54:03] Wayne: big news. By the way, that went viral. 

[00:54:05] Tony: It did go viral. 

[00:54:06] Wayne: Hey, the other thing is, Peter Wright was even an avid watcher of that, uh, episode. Of course he was.

[00:54:10] Wayne: But players watch stuff that involves them. But I talk about exciting. We've partnered up with a new punters app called Surge. Not a mate of yours from 

[00:54:20] Tony: Ligon Street is he? Surge, I tell you what it's Oh, it's a new gambling app? Yes, a new gambling 

[00:54:28] Wayne: app and it's a, well punters app, it's, I'll tell you what's exciting because it's Really?

[00:54:34] Wayne: Now is your four week band up? Are you actually allowed to watch football? I am allowed to watch football if I want to because at the end of the day I can break that, uh, but I, I, I am going to give my tips on the games this weekend. I don't need to have watched all of the games live or, or seen them. I've watched enough football and I'm reading enough to know who's in form, who's out of form, who's not, and who, let's be honest, I could [00:55:00] actually be put in a coma.

[00:55:02] Wayne: Right? For, I reckon, five years and still know more about footy than what you would. Do you think you're, what, the Bold and the Beautiful episode, are you? No, but I, I still reckon, I reckon, I honestly reckon I could put in a, I could be put in a coma and still know more about you than footy. More about me or more about football?

[00:55:20] Wayne: No, no more about football, right? So, what we're going to do is we're going to give some tips on the games this week. 

[00:55:28] Tony: Well, I'll tell you what, Surge does sound like the best app out there on the market. 

[00:55:32] Wayne: Yeah, very good. Obviously, Sky Racing and all that sort of stuff they're involved in. It is, and I've been on it.

[00:55:40] Wayne: I've been having a little bit of a play around and you know what you get? You get a surge 

[00:55:44] Tony: of odds. So just for the, Hey, just for all the punters out there, duck. It's S U R G E. Yep. It's pretty easy. 

[00:55:52] Wayne: Now let's go through these games. Thursday night, Thursday night, you got the saints V the dogs. Well, I know what you would like.

[00:55:58] Wayne: You would just back them because Ross Lyons [00:56:00] coach. I tell you what I tell you, what I do is I trust, I trust the saints effort. Now, I, I, I think the dogs clearly have been probably a little bit more on the disappointing side but I tell you what, I'll, I'd be tipping the crows, ah, the crows, sorry, the, the saints 

[00:56:17] Tony: in this one.

[00:56:17] Tony: I tell you how good Ross Lyon is, he got within one point of the Giants on the weekend. A few injuries though. On Fox 40 last night, did you see the, uh, security girls pulling all the signage down? From the rooms, uh, halfway through the last quarter and then someone rang them and said, we're about to win this and they had to put it back up.

[00:56:35] Tony: I tell you, the Friday 

[00:56:36] Wayne: night game's an interesting one too. Crows. Hey, you gotta give the odds for Saints and Bulldogs. Yeah, 1. 70 to 10 at this stage. Friday night. Friday night, Crows v the Dons. Uh, Crows 1. 51, the Dons 1. 50. What's that? 256. 256 right at this point in time. Crows back in some form and the Dons are up and down as we know.

[00:56:56] Wayne: This could be one that they're down. Especially over there. [00:57:00] I'd, I'd. Who do you like? I'm going to go with the favourites in that one as well. 

[00:57:03] Tony: Yeah. 

[00:57:03] Wayne: Saturday night. And Saturday night, 45, the Cats 2. 60 and as we said, that is, well, it's sort of long for the Cats. I would have thought they're undefeated, Tony.

[00:57:15] Wayne: I'm sorry, man, for the Lions. We did say, though, that the, well, they haven't played anyone really good. Yeah. Well, playing, playing, playing. Playing the Lions at the Gabba is obviously a massive, massive game. So I'm going for, I'm tipping the 

[00:57:29] Tony: three favourites. No, I'm going for the Cats. I really like them, even though they've got to travel to Brisbane.

[00:57:35] Tony: I just think they'll be too good. And I think they'll probably get big Tommy Hawk back and a 260. I'll 

[00:57:40] Wayne: get a few odds. Yep. No, I'd like I said, go the lines. I think those three for me, that's who I'm tipping. And let's not forget, chances are you're about to lose for freak confidential support called 1 800.

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[00:58:24] Wayne: Um, ahem, mate. Surge only works in the punting verse.

[00:58:35] Wayne: Download it today and enjoy your next punt with FOWR! What are you really gambling with? For free and confidential support, call the number on the screen or visit the website. I'm Wayne Carey, and this is The Truth 

[00:58:48] Hurts.